deer shot

[kriss]

where do you shoot a deer? i know turkeys are shot in the head so as not to damage the meat. Are deers also shot in the head? will a shot in the head affect the beauty of the mount?:D

[fabsroman]

Generally, a whitetail deer is shot right behind the shoulder so that you will get a lung and heart shot. If you place the bullet correctly, about the only meat lost should be a couple of ribs. If the deer is a buck, I usually try to shoot it right in the front shoulder so that I can break its shoulder and stop it from going anywhere.

Head shots can be taken, but they are rather tough and they will definitely destroy what a mount looks like. Since I have never even tried a head shot on a deer, I do not know if they are always fatal when they connect. I know deer have pretty small brains, but I would think any bullet with some oompf behind it would do the job if it hits the deer anywhere in the head. One scenario that I can think of that would prevent me from trying a head shot is where you shoot the deer's lower jaw off and then it will starve to death if it does not die from loss of blood.

[gd357]

I will backup what fabs told you. I've seen a few head shots that didn't kill the animal and a follow-up shot was needed. The smart choice is a broadside chest shot that will take out the lungs and possibly the heart.

gd

[Skyline]

"I know deer have pretty small brains, but I would think any bullet with some oompf behind it would do the job if it hits the deer anywhere in the head."

Ah, sorry fabs but many animals are wounded and left to die a slow death by guys that muff a head shot. You alluded to the jaw problem, but noses and nasal passages smashed to hell, holes through the wind pipe, front of the jaw blown off, the jaw smashed and hanging.......I have seen all of these several times. Why just last fall some muzzleloader hunter shot the jaw off of a whitetail that was later taken down by coyotes in one of my pastures.

A head shot should only be taken if you are absolutely sure of your shot placement to the brain or spine juncture.

Yes absolutely to the lung/heart shot.

[L. Cooper]

The first shot at a deer should be at the largest lethal target. That is the heart lung area. Think of it as a balloon through which the bullet must pass from whatever presentation angle you are facing.

Head shots should be finishing shots only.

There are way too many ways to wound a deer with a head shot (lower jaw shot away is one example I found) that result in a deer that can still run like a deer, but which will die a lingering and painful death.

[fabsroman]

Skyline,

When I said "anywhere in the head" I wasn't thinking of the jaw or nose, but the actual skull area around the brain. Might not have to be right through the brain, because the shock and impact would do the trick.

With that said, I would never take a head shot unless I was starving and really needed the deer. I can kill does out here almost any day of the week, so I have no real desire to shoot at the head of a doe that is sitting behind a tree. I can wait for them to move. It is all about patience. Now, if it is a big buck that is hiding behind a tree and the only thing you can see is its head, you really cannot take that shot either because you will destory the head mount.

[HPBTMTCH]

Yes, head shots should only be taken if the animal is looking directly at or away from you, otherwise a hit in the jaw or nose is a horrible way to die.

[rem 700]

The red represents the area of lungs, heart and liver. Green is the digestive system, which should be avoided.
http://www.pcarchery.com/images/targets/deer_vitals2.gif

[WT Kevorkian]

I am surprised nobody has mentioned a neck shot which will drop any deer right in its tracks everytime. I have also seen several deer shot right in the butt of the shoulder with a shotgun slug and muzzleloaders that were never recovered, it depends mostly on the size of the deer,,, that shot will drop does right in their tracks everytime but on large bodied bucks the bullet just mashes out flat against the bone,,,, rifles are an entirely different subject though and they would probably do the job with out much problem even on big deer

[fabsroman]

Depends on the bullet used on the big deer and the velocity of the bullet. I shot a button buck at 25 yards with my .300 Win Mag and the old Remington Core Lokt bullets and there was no exit wound because the bullet completely disintegrated before getting to the other side. It was enough devastation on the button buck (i.e., blood came out of the entrance wound like the Old Faithful gizer sp.) to drop him in his tracks, but I don't know how that bullet would have performed if it was a big buck and I hit bone somewhere in there. Now, with the Barnes X bullets I use, I seriously doubt there would be any problem breaking bone, etc. with the .300 Win Mag.

Are you still using the Barnes X bullet sabots in your slug gun? If so, how have they been working on the bigger deer? I would assume well. Last year I didn't get to use them much because I couldn't find them around here. Hence, I used the Remington premium crapola. Wasn't satisfied with the patterning on those rounds, but that was all I could find around here (i.e., Dicks).

As far as the neck shot is concerned, I took one on a wounded doe that Diamante shot last season, and I had to stare at the thing while she gasped for breath for about a minute. I was going to shoot her in the head after the neck shot, but Diamante didn't want me to. No idea why I ever listen to anybody but myself.

[WT Kevorkian]

Still using the barnes x slugs, got them from natchez last time, but I see the price has went up from last year. They have performed well for me although I usually hunt with my muzzleloader most of the time just because it has a much better trigger pull and I feel more confident with it. As long as I hit them behind the shoulder or in the neck it is no problem.

[L. Cooper]

While a shot that hits the brain in a head shot or the spinal cord in a neck shot will be devastatingly lethal, the trouble with both head and neck shots is that there is a whole lot of head and neck that is not brain or spine.

A deer's brain is about the size of a large walnut. Can you hit a walnut offhand at 100 yards? The spine is longer of course, but is not much bigger in diameter, and many people don't even understand where exactly it passes through the neck of a deer. They think it is just under the top of the neck line.

Any shot that doesn't incapacitate the brain or spinal cord of an animal is a wounding shot that will very seldom prove fatal of itself. Starvation, thirst, and infection will eventually make the animal weak enough to attract predators, but that may take days. If the animal is lucky, maybe some vital blood vessles will be severed enough for it to bleed to death in an hour or two, but gunshot wounds are often too "messy" to allow good bleeding in muscle tissue.

The first shot at unwounded non-dangerous big game should be at the largest lethal target. That is the heart and lung area of the chest.

Sorry to be so adamant about this, but I have seen several deer with non-lethal head and neck wounds during my hunting lifetime, and every time it was very sad indeed. One thing hunters must never do if we don't want the anti-hunters to gain any advantage is to allow unnecessary suffering.

Make the first shot a killing shot, even at the expense of a little meat.

[WT Kevorkian]

A bullet doesn't have to hit the spine itself on a neck shot to imobilize a deer, the shock to the spinal column is what does the job. If you center punch the neck that deer will not get up, I have shot close to 100 deer in the head and neck and never had one get up, call it what you want, I hate tracking deer, and its a much cleaner job come time to field dress them too. By the way a deers brain is a whole lot bigger than a walnut and you have got at least a large apple sized area that if hit will completely immobilize the deer instantly, and there are a lot of people who can hit an apple everytime at 100 yards maybe not off hand but with a good rest,,, absolute piece of cake. I don't pass judgement on anyone and I respect everyone's feelings on this but if someone has taken the time to practice with their gun and has 100% confidence in taking a head shot,,,, carried out correctly it is the most humane shot that can be taken, there's no running, walking, nothing,,, maybe a little quivering and that is it! To each his own, and I can agree that there are a lot of people who have no buisness attempting a head or neck shot and do so anyway just for an ego trip, that said the irresponsibility and poor shooting ability of others has no bearing on the effectiveness of head and neck shots carried out properly.

[L. Cooper]

I agreed, if you look closely, that carried out correctly, there is nothing more lethal than a brain or spine shot.

I still say, it is far more difficult to carry out correctly than it is to botch it up. My point is not about the effectivenss of the shot, it's advice about where to shoot deer for humane and certain kills.

Maybe I'm just not a good enough shot. I have for sure hunted enough to know that not every shot goes within a couple of inches of where I want it to go.

As my grandfather once said while I was beating myself up for shooting badly, "If you ain't never missed, you ain't done much shooting." That was 46 years ago.

He was absolutely correct. I have never since taken a first shot at the head or neck.

[rem 700]

If you go for a nervous system shot, unless at close range, I'd go for the shoulder because if you miss it and go low you've just hit the very large target of the lungs, and the deer will die whether you hit one or the other.

[fabsroman]

Yep, I am not a big fan of the neck or head shot either. Not enough room for error. If the deer moves slightly, you are in trouble. Also, as I posted above, the wounded deer I shot in the neck wasn't dead after the shot. She kept looking up at me while laying on the ground, smoke was coming out of her neck, and she was gasping for breath. I never should have listened to my hunting buddy on that shot or not shooting her again.

The best performance I have had out of the Barnes X bullet in my shotgun was on a doe. It entered from the left rear hindquarters and we found it lodged in the right front shoulder. She dropped in her tracks. The sabot/bullet had all its petals completely opened and it completely destroyed the deer.

With a good shot in the heart and lungs, the deer is only running on pure adrenaline and is completely in shock.

However, if I was told I was going to die by a gun shot and I were given the choice of being shot in the brain and being shot in the chest, I would prefer to be shot in the brain. Problem is that most of the hunters out there cannot make a brain or spinal column shot consistantly, me included.

[skeeter@ccia.com]

Same thoughts here with the heart/lung. This day and age we all can pass some unsure shots because meat hunting isn't needed. I had at one time seen the same buck on my wall 6 times before he presented that sure kill shot....meanwhile, it gave me thrill after thrill while playing the hunting game. I let many nice deer pass while unsure of the shot be it backround or just not that heart/lung shot......a lesson learned years ago.

[trex]

I'll take a high shoulder shot myself. Little high and the neck is broken at the base. Little low, and the shoulder is done and the lungs are taken out. I've killed quite a few and they usually drop without even a quiver.

[Andy L]

I normally shoot for the chest. Best IMO.

I have taken several neck shots and had good luck. But WT, your every time statement is not true. Case in point. In 1986, my dad killed a 172" deer on our farm. Killed it with a heart/lung chest shot with a 30-06. Word got out quick about this buck as there arent alot that big killed in that area. One of the neighbors came by the barn to see it and said that looked identical to a buck he shot at earlier in the season. I quizzed him about it and he said he couldnt believe he had missed. It was less than 100 yards and an easy shot with his 270. Even had the gun and the core lokt bullets he used with him. Said he tried to neck shoot it.

I was about ready to skin the buck anyway, so we peeled it and sure enough, in the meat just above the spine was a perfectly shaped 270 core lokt bullet. Why the bullet didnt pass thru or expand and kill the deer, I have no idea. Just a bullet and a bruise in the meat. Thats all there was.

I agree, I havent had any trouble with the neck shots I have taken either. But that broad stroked blanket statement of "every time" is not correct. I have seen otherwise.

Andy

[Lilred]

I'll just throw this porcupine in ya'll bloomers.....how many deer over the years ya'll heard that got kilt by a 22lr? That question is just bein sarcastic....cause the answer is more than anybody would want to admit.

[WT Kevorkian]

Ok so by the grace of god one animal survived a neck shot, from a rifle no less,, absolutely amazing, but the story doesn't make sense, at 100 yards or less there is not a chance in he** that the bullet wouldn't of went all the way through the deers neck especially if as you say the bullet didn't even expand, I mean think about what you are saying here, it's not possible that what the guy told you is true. Either the distance is wrong, the bullet hit something else on its way to the deer, (which wouldn't go along with it being perfectly shaped),, the list of speculation could go on and on, but I can guarantee you this,,, something happend out of the ordinary, way out of the ordinary, I mean that is obvious. I still stand by what I said, barring an absolute act of god, or some other strange occurence if you center punch a deer right in the neck it will drop right where it stands and will not get up,,, ever!

Lilred, your going to start an uproar :D but by the way just for grins I've been told 22 mag is the choice round here. And the number of deer hit in that little reflective spot would have a whole lot of zeros behind it thats for sure. It don't make it right, sure ain't respectable, and it aint my style but its the gods honest truth and it happens every day, and night!!! And it boils my blood!!

[Andy L]

No use arguing with juvies.... It happened. And of course, you gotta be right.... Everyone else is wrong....

:rolleyes:

[WT Kevorkian]

Hey I never said you were wrong or this didn't happen, I'm not argueing with you I'm just saying its an odd occurence is all, Strange things do happen there is no denying that. What about the buck I killed in 93' that had a hole all the way through it right behind the legs ( right where the heart is supposed to be) and it was big enough to put your fist into on the one side, it had been that way for quite awhile cause infection had set in, the deer wasn't even fit to eat but before I shot it ,, it was still running around and very much alive. Strange but true, so I guess the heart lung shot kills them everytime aint true either. Who knows what happened??? Certainly not I, I am not a scientist. I've sent almost 300 deer to the butcher in my lifetime and this season is just starting up, so if that still constitutes a juvie in the deer woods so be it. Hope you have a great season!

[8X56MS]

A neck shot has always been my favorite target with whitetails. I have not lost an animal, or failed to down the deer with a single shot. I am fairly particular about the angle with neck shots though. I won't try that shot unless the deer is facing me fairly square.
I try to picture a line drawn through the deer, and plan the angle of my shot accordingly, to hit the heart.

[fabsroman]

8x56,

How does a neck shot hit the heart? I am having one heck of a time trying to visualize that. If you are shooting the deer right between the shoulders as it is facing you, then I can see the bullet hitting the heart. I think the rest of us are talking about neck shots where the deer is standing broadside; however, a neck shot while the deer is facing you might be the best way to go because there is a really high chance of hitting the spine with the bullet mushrooming. On the broadside neck shot, the chance of hitting the spine with the bullet is rather small.

[skeeter@ccia.com]

I can't remember what brand ammo I was using at the time federal or remington (now only winchester) but I once hit a buck running 4 out of 5 times in the neck and one in the side and it still managed to elude me enough to cross a road, jump a guide rail and go another 50yds...I never aim at the neck but I guess the words lead them was in my head..at @50yds from me I think the lead was too much at the time but didn't know back then. It was the last buck taken at my old homestead before rt 60 mowed down the house and put in a 4 lane road..it would have been standing in the middle of the road today...The deer is mounted on the wall. Destruction of the skin/ fur..was not even enough to mess up a mount....I call it a 9pt but the buck pool called it an 11. Reasons to get mounted were won pool and was last deer taken before destruction of my hunting grounds..now I say it was bad ammunition and my cousin had the same problem with it..no expansion..only pencil holes were made....but I would think taking that many hits in the neck would stop anything...Now do you use a shotgun where these neck shots are taken? Buckshot? Distance? What about the size of the deer itself..Some of the bigger ones are like bulls. Myself, I wouldn't take that shot unless it was a fine deer and was standing behind trees ready to run and that was the only shot I had without the possibility of a better one. This being the case, I did take one years ago and it dropped in it's tracks. I used winchester ammo on that one. Just my experiences. To each his own.

[jmarriott]

Originally posted by Lilred
I'll just throw this porcupine in ya'll bloomers.....how many deer over the years ya'll heard that got kilt by a 22lr? That question is just bein sarcastic....cause the answer is more than anybody would want to admit.

My grandfather told me of a guy that poached deer spotlighting with a 22 mag. Slight pop noise, drive away, come back 3 hours later on foot with rat terrier, drag deer to road, walk to truck, pick up at road. Must have killed them with chest shots cause he always let them set for 3 hours. My gandfather hated that guy and said he stole traps and dogs. He also hand a number of great upsate new york racks in his card room.

With the decoy deer used now to control this unlawful behavior I bet he would get busted.

Pistol hunting with guy who is a great shot, He had a small buck with a messed up rack on one side and he took a head shot at 15 yards with a 44 mag. He hit right under/behind the eye. The deer ran off straight toward my stand 1/2 a mile acrossed a huge corn field jumped the fence at 120 yards and stood there pawwing at the wound. I had a good rest off a 20 foot ladder stand and placed what i thought was a great shot into the deers shoulder with a T/C in .35 rem because he went down and only pushed with his back legs into the woods 1/8 mile away.

When we finally trailed this buck down it crossed a creek and backtracked awhile before dieing next to a large tree stump. I guess some deer go father than others because other then being a bit low my shot hit the chest and both legs just under the shoulder and the exit side leg was broken almost missing. I wish he had shot the lungs as that deer would not have got out of the field to my stand. To hard of a retrieval as the climb at night out of that bottom was a nightmare.

No head shot ever take by me after that. but this is a handgun/shotgun state.

[skeeter@ccia.com]

sneaking up on a bedded deer tonight I got within 35yds of it over the crest of a hill when I checked behind me as I do all the time and a doe was sneaking up on me but it didn't know I was there...with the crossbow laying in my arms facing left, sure it would come on the right side of me...soon as the head got behind a tree, I flipped the bow and shot left handed 15 yds....both lungs and it only walked, not run, 5 more steps and fell over....just another lung shot that didn't go far....so black powder season starts in the morning here in pa. Maybe get another one early..
I made my phone call from the woods and daughter/son-in-law came back with my new cart...yep..works fine and heck with the dragging anymore....love them kids too...