Howdy Folks
Dumbo...I mean Zumbo pretty much put his foot in his mouth.
Just because a rifle looks a certain way dosen't make it any less deadly / dangerous. Like I tell people would you know the difference if you were shot with a AR-15 in .223 caliber in the left shoulder and then shot in the right shoulder with a Remington 700 in the same caliber? Obviously they wouldn't, all they would know is that they are not having a good day.
I know folks who hunt deer with their AR'S IN .308 CAL and I don't have a problem with it. They are serious hunters, make the first shot count and don't go spraying and praying that they hit the deer.
Thanks for the web sites Rocky they will be hearing from me too.
MC

Just in case you all had not seen it, Mr. Zumbo's "apology/explanation/mea culpa is posted below for your edification.

I especially like the part about "I was hunting coyotes, and after the hunt was over and being beat up by 60 mph winds all day..."

A bit of cheese to go with his whine would be good at this point. He would have been far more credible had he just claimed he was drunk at the time.

Ted Nugent, mentioned in the last paragraph was the first to jump to Mr. Zumbo's defense on one or more websites. I never cared much for Mr. Nugent anyway. Now I have another reason.

Flame suit on, fire away.



"Someone once said that to err is human. I just erred, and made without question, the biggest blunder in my 42 years of writing hunting articles.

My blog inflamed legions of people I love most..... hunters and shooters. Obviously, when I wrote that blog, I activated my mouth before engaging my brain.

Let me explain the circumstances surrounding that blog. I was hunting coyotes, and after the hunt was over and being beat up by 60 mph winds all day, I was discussing hunting with one of the young guides. I was tired and exhausted, and I should have gone to bed early. When the guide told me that there was a "huge" following of hunters who use AR 15's and similar weapons to hunt prairies dogs, I was amazed. At that point I wrote the blog, and never thought it through.

Now then, you might not believe what I have to say, but I hope you do. How is it that Zumbo, who has been hunting for more than 50 years, is totally ignorant about these types of guns. I don't know. I shot one once at a target last year, and thought it was cool, but I never considered using one for hunting. I had absolutely no idea how vast the numbers of folks are who use them.

I never intended to be divisive, and I certainly believe in United we Stand, Divided we Fall. I've been an NRA member for 40 years, have attended 8 national NRA conventions in the last 10 years, and I'm an advisory board member for the United States Sportsmen's Alliance which actively fights anti-hunters and animal rights groups for hunter's rights.

What really bothers me are some of the unpatriotic comments leveled at me. I fly the flag 365 days a year in my front yard. Last year, through an essay contest, I hosted a soldier wounded in Iraq to a free hunt in Botswana. This year, through another essay contest, I'm taking two more soldiers on a free moose and elk hunt.

When I started blogging, I was told to write my thoughts, expressing my own opinion. The offensive blog I wrote was MY opinion, and no one else's. None of the companies that I deal with share that opinion, nor were they aware of what I had written until this firestorm started.

Believe it or not, I'm your best friend if you're a hunter or shooter, though it might not seem that way. I simply screwed up. And, to show that I'm sincere about this, I just talked to Ted Nugent, who everyone knows, and is a Board member of the NRA. Ted is extremely active with charities concerning our wounded military, and though he's known as a bowhunter, Ted has no problem with AR 15's and similar firearms. My sincerity stems from the fact that Ted and I are planning a hunt using AR 15's. I intend to learn all I can about them, and again, I'm sorry for inserting my foot in my mouth."

Well I'd say that this is a good WAKE UP call to a bunch of guys and gals out there who are not NRA members because of this or that the NRA does or does not do.

We're in this together and gotta stick together. I mean, to say, well, I don't need or use this or that type pistol or weapon so who cares if it's outlawed -- is not the right answer. If our rights are not represented, it won't be long before your M9 or 870 or 1400 or 7400 are also on the 'hit' list.

The NRA represents us on the legal front, support them not because of what they do or don't do, but because of what they are defending, the right of legal law abiding citizens to own a variety of weapons, Waidmannsheil, Dom. (NRA Endowment Life Member)

Zumbo can always do a cooking show on a ladies channel-
He and others around, even other writers
at times, are a symptom of the sporting goods store/no gunshop syndrome. Like 5 acres of tents, treestands, fishing stuff,
boats ,atvs, safes, shoes, clothing,
feed, decoys,ad nauseum..........and
a puny 200 sq ft of politically correct guns.
He opened his mouth and ended up a
blithering idiot, helping the Brady bunch.

Famous gun types should say enlightened stuff like
"If she had gun collection...
I'm the father".......................Ed

Got an email
 

From Outdoor Life and they have dumped dum..er..Zumbo also. At least they did the right thing:D

I found these on another site:
http://www.hunt101.com/img/475125.jpg
http://www.hunt101.com/img/475137.jpg

I noticed a few minutes ago, Cabelas/Gerber Knives and NRA have also dumped him. Now, if people would do the same for the Kenedy family................................
Dan
;)

Below I've posted Mr. Zumbo's latest apology/whine I found on another forum, supposedly originally posted on Mr. Nugent's website. I'm just passing it on here and cannot vouch for its authenticity.

I find it rather lame, but that's just my opinion. Note he says he is "pro-hunting" but makes no mention of being "pro right to keep and bear arms." The right to hunt, which is the only thing that seems to matter to him, is indeed precious, as I think all of us would agree. However, the right to own firearms for potential self-defense is far, far more important in the big picture. It appears that he still just doen't get it.

ZUMBO POST

"The last few days have been an educational experience, to say the least. My ill-conceived inflammatory blog, as all of you now know, set off a firestorm that, I’m told, has never before been equaled. I’m not proud of that.
Let me say this at the outset. My words here are from the heart, and all mine. No one can censor me, and I answer to no one but myself. And I have no one to blame but myself. Outdoor Life, a magazine that I worked for full-time as Hunting Editor for almost 30 years, fired me yesterday. My TV show was cancelled yesterday. Many of my sponsors have issued statements on their website to sever all relationships. This may cause many of you to do backflips and dance in the streets, but, of course, I’m not laughing, nor am I looking for sympathy. I don’t want a pity party.

They say hindsight is golden. Looking back, I can’t believe I said the words “ban” and “terrorist” in the context that I did. I don’t know what I was thinking when I wrote that. I can explain this as sheer ignorance and an irresponsible use of words. What I’ve learned over the last few days has enlightened and amazed me. As a guy who hunts 200 days a year, does seminars on hunting, wrote for six hunting magazines, had a hunting TV show, and wrote 20 books on hunting, how could I have been so ignorant and out of touch with reality in the world of hunting and shooting?

But I was. I really can’t explain it, maybe because I just summarily dismissed the firearms in question in my mind when I saw them in magazines and catalogs. I saw one “black” firearm in a hunting camp in all my 50 years of hunting, and I shot one last year off a boat when fishing in Alaska. To tell the truth, it was fun and I enjoyed it immensely, but I never considered one for use in hunting. I have to tell you that I have had a revelation. I’m learning that many of my pals own AR-15’s and similar firearms and indeed use them for hunting. I was totally unaware that they were being used for legitimate hunting purposes. That is the absolute truth.

My biggest regret is not the financial impact of all this. I’m almost 67 and retirement is an option. The dreadful impact here is that I inadvertently struck a spear into the hearts of the people I love most…America’s gun owners. And, even though this huge cadre of dedicated people have succeeded in stripping me of my career, I hold no grudges. I will continue to stand as firm on pro hunting as I’ve ever done. But what’s different now is that I’ll do all I can to educate others who are, or were, as ignorant as I was about “black” rifles and the controversy that surrounds them. My promise to you is that I’ll learn all I can about these firearms, and by the time this week is out, I’ll order one. The NUGE has invited me to hunt with him using AR-15’s, and I’m eager to go, and learn. I’ll do all I can to spread the word.

I understand that many of you will not accept this apology, believing that the damage has been done and there’s no way to repair it. You have that right. But let me say this. I mentioned this above, and I’ll repeat it. I’m willing to seize this opportunity to educate hunters and shooters who shared my ignorance. If you’re willing to allow me to do that, we can indeed, in my mind, form a stronger bond within our ranks. Maybe in a roundabout way we can bring something good out of this."

Jim Zumbo

Zumbo just doesn't get it
 

He blames the average joe for destroying his career!

"And, even though this huge cadre of dedicated people have succeeded in stripping me of my career, I hold no grudges."

Why does he blame us for doing that? He did it to himself! Now how to tell him. I do have his phone number(don't ask!) I really don't think he will ever get it. :confused: :rolleyes:

Skeet, Aim to Maim;

I pretty much agree. Apparently from his response he does not get it.

I am a life long Hunter. I will support hunting as long as I live, but there is no constitutional right guaranateed specifically in the Constitution.

We are not, for example, guaranteed the right to "Keep and bear sporting goods".

Riposte

Sorry, this don't cut it either.

He says he can't believe he used the words "terrorist" and "banned" I wonder if he'd feel that way if it wasn't for the backlash the statement created. Would he have issued an apology if he hadn't receive any negative comments ?

The fact that these rifles are used for his idea of " legitimate hunting purposes " seems irrelavent. Who made him the spokesman for what is legitimate or not.

By the way, isn't that a "black" synthetic stock rifle he's holding ?

The less press attention he gets from now on, the better.

Everybody makes mistakes and are entitled to a second chance. Maybe this will be a good lesson for politicians too. Maybe they will finally see that there are a bunch of sportsmen and gun owners in the world that are not going to stand for this crap.

I wouldn't care about owning a firearm if every person in the world were nice, but they aren't. I have friends of mine that never shot a firearm before they saw what happened in New Orleans. Now, they went out and bought handguns and have been going to the range. I went to lunch with them, and they were worried about not having an AR if stuff hit the fan, so I told them to buy one. Now, Maryland legislators are talking about banning them. It wasn't bad enough that LEO's too firearms away from law abiding citizens in New Orleans and have not yet given them back. Now, Maryland wants to ban some firearms on top of it. With politicians in office like this, it really pisses me off. Too bad Nagin got re-elected. Maybe, just maybe, he will lose enough votes over the gun issue that he will not be re-elected again. I just think good people do not want to run for office because of all the crap involved.

I'll accept Mr. Zumbo's apology, but he will have to earn my respect.

Guess he didn't understand Yamamotos comment bout
waiking a sleeping giant.........................
Dan

By the way, I just want to be clear that I am not going to be supporting Mr. Zumbo by watching his show or endorsing him, and I do believe that people need to pay for their mistakes. With that said, I believe Mr. Zumbo has paid for his mistake with the loss of his job and endorsements, and I truly believe that he is sorry for screwing up. I'll harbor no ill will to him should I actually run in to him somehow.

"I wouldn't care about owning a firearm if every person in the world were nice, but they aren't."

Fabs, I honestly cannot believe you just wrote those words. If everyone were nice, you wouldnt care about owning a firearm. You would be willing to give up hunting, range time and just the shear pleasure of the right to own a firearm if "everyone were nice".

Thats sick. I just cannot believe what I just read.

Hey,Like Fab said "We ALL make mistakes" . MC:D

Yep, everybody makes mistakes, including me. Mine just aren't as big as Zumbo's. See, if we go off of my statement, there is no way that guns will ever be banned because there is no way that there will be no crime or violence in the world. Yeah, I wouldn't want to give up my guns even if everybody is nice, but it makes me look like a good guy in the anti's eyes. Sure I would give up my guns if you could promise me no crime or violence, or the possibility of a terrorist attack or an invasion by China. Quite honestly, if I had the choice between getting rid of guns and there being absolutely no violence in the world any more, I think I would be fine with it. However, I sit in way too many Court rooms where I get to see batteries that happened without the use of firearms. I have seen pics of women beaten pretty badly without the use of a firearm. So, there is no way that violence will ever end. Personally, I think everybody that is mentally stable should be required to carry a gun. That way, people will think twice about being violent.

What would the world be like if we all got along? If there were no murder, rapes, beatings, child molesting, etc? Andy, if God came down tomorrow and asked you if you would be willing to forego firearms for the rest of your life in return for him making it so no child would ever be molested again, how could you ever say no, I think I would prefer to shoot my guns for the fun of it. I know I couldn't.

Okay, it is really late and I have been working on tax returns for way too long today. I even think I contradicted myself in this post a couple of times. Hence, I am getting to sleep.

"Andy, if God came down tomorrow and asked you if you would be willing to forego firearms for the rest of your life in return for him making it so no child would ever be molested again, how could you ever say no,"

Fabs if this happened, I would probably drawn iorn on god and tell him to tell Pelosi, or whatever deamon got to him to make a deal, to stick it where the sun dont shine. God would never ask good people to do something like that without being pinched. Either that or shoot the imposter.

I know you didnt mean what you said, or at least dont think so? You dont have guns for fear of your life, I know better than that. You like the same things I do.

I couldnt resist callin you on it though. You like to lawyer up on me all the time.

:)

FABS, FABS, FABS
 

In both those posts you seriously sound like one of the Brady Bunch. Seriously. What you are doing is demonizing firearms. The way it comes across is that guns are responsible for all the evil things in the world. I know you know better but this is exactly what Zumbo did. He demonized a certain type of firearm and their owners. C'mon man...I know you are tired and the wind really hasn't been blowing 60 but these are the exact tactics the antis use against us. Save the chillun. I'd love to see no harm come to anyone in the world..but them A-rabs don't believe in the same god as you and me...not really and them Chinese don't believe in no god. And I can really use the double and triple negatives to make me look like a ol' redneck country boy. But you know better than to say stuff that ain't even close to reality. Guns are only as evil as their masters:eek: :D

Give up my guns if god came down and stopped all the bad stuff in the world? Well, Hillary thinks she is God! Give 'em to her!

What I find ironic is that after being on this board for around 6+ years, you guys really don't know me. Yes, I have guns because I use them for fun things, but also because I have nightmares. When I lived with my parents, I had nightmares about people breaking into the house and forcing me to make a shot with my dad held hostage. I have had the same nightmare happen on the hunting field where two guys have handguns and have my dad hostage and are talking to me through his handheld. Sometimes, I am 200 yards away with the .300 Win Mag and I have to make two shots in a crosswind. Sometimes I am 50 yards behind the morons high in a treestand. Recently, I have been having nightmares about people coming into my townhouse and me having to defend my wife and baby. Sometimes they are just plain bad guys, but last night's nightmare involved bad cops. I also have another nightmare where there are masked guys outside my window involved in a firefight with the police and I shoot both of them with an AR-10. At first, that nightmare resulted in both of the perps being my brother and me being responsible for their deaths. Since those initial nightmares, it has migrated to them not being my brothers, but into all kinds of other scenarios, like a police sniper shooting at me because he thinks I am one of the bad guys, to me being prosectured and sued afterward for murder/wrongful death. The recent one about bad cops breaking in probably has to do with a protective order case I am handling right now against a police officer. I cannot get into the details, but suffice it to say that he has wrongfully threatened people with his handgun. Oh yeah, then there is the nightmare where I have webcams set up in certain rooms of my parents' house so I can make sure that they are okay, and I witness bad cops executing them because they will not open the gun safe. That dream has migrated to my brothers also seeing it via web link and them getting into a fire fight with the police and heading to my house so we can alert the media and FBI. The list of my horrible dreams goes on and on. My wife talks to me about hers, but I don't feel like talking to her about these much, so most of the time I tell her that I didn't have any. Every once in a while I will tell her about one though.

Real life, my wife and I were awoken at 5:00 in the morning to what sounded like people coming up our stairway. The dog was barking and I could hear voices. Both my wife and I were scared to death, and I was extremely glad I had the HK 9mm at hand. Turned out to be some furniture delivery men delivering some couches to the next door neighbor whose staircase is right behind our bed. Man, was that a relief.

For those of you that live in the country, I am willing to bet that the crime rate is rather low. Here, while the crime rate is pretty decent, there are some shady spots. You should see the number of child molesters that live in my area. It isn't as bad as some of the crappier parts of the city, but there are enough to have me worried about it.

"Fabs if this happened, I would probably drawn iorn on god and tell him to tell Pelosi, or whatever deamon got to him to make a deal, to stick it where the sun dont shine. God would never ask good people to do something like that without being pinched. Either that or shoot the imposter."

I have no idea what iorn means, but maybe my example was a bad one for those that do not believe in God. Your response Andy is also a bad one though. We could go back and forth about the God statement (e.g., what if it was truly God, what if would truly happen), but we all know God isn't going to come down and promise us that there will no longer be any crime if guns are taken away. If Hilary wants to make a promise to me that all crime will go away and we no longer will need a criminal Court system if we give up our guns, and she is willing to back this promise with her life and the rest of the lives of those in Congress voting on it, I am all for it. Of course, we would need to medically install GPS's in them so they can be located for execution the day after the bill is signed because we all know crime isn't going to stop and the criminals aren't going to turn in their guns. We all know that China will continue to produce guns and there will be a black market for them for all the criminals here. I don't think getting rid of guns will work, but I want my guns more for fear of the 300 lb criminal and/or the criminal that will have one illegally while I have nothing, than for all the fun times that I have had with guns.

We can continue to go on and on with this debate, but I am going to leave it alone. You guys can continue to feel like you know everything that I am about, but I don't think anybody knows that. This is one of those subjective debates where there is no right or wrong answer, kind of like the debate I am having about God in another thread, which I am going to make my last post to in a minute. We presume to know why the arabs hate us, but we have no clue. That is probably like the feud between the Hatfields and the McCoys, which started over something stupid and continued for generations over stupidity.

Dumbo Zumbo or Closet Zealot?
 

These are my two cents worth... :)

To make a statement like that, has to come from inside. This was not a thought out statement, that is why it is so attendant upon us to rid ourselves of those who harbor such bias, especially in public forum.

We all make mistakes. Apologizing is the right thing to do. I forgive Jim Zumbo his transgression. I don't hold grudges. But I have been involved in the hunting community working to protect our hunting and gun rights since 1993. In a sense, JZ is now a sacrificial lamb, but it had to be done. If you don't think shumer, Pelosi, Reed, Kerry aren't going to push for assault weapons ban and other gun control issues as hard as they can now they are in power, its important to remember that we must take anything and everything seriously.

To have JZ, the NOTED writer come out with such passion against a god given gun right without thought is serious stuff. It says what he is and who he is... this was not just a mistake, this is evident of his core belief, and I for one want no part of it..regardless that he is a gentleman.

There are somethings that one issue can take my vote... guns is one of them.

So though I agree with some that he probably had no malice, although he was pretty passionate about it.. I'm giving him a BIG benefit of the doubt here, but to so blithely dismiss a gun right, to so blithely remark that they are terrorist guns, and to so blithely state that they had no business in any hunting environment tells me a little something about him that is appalling, at the least, worrisome at best. I am a conspiracy theorist.

So being a conspiracy theorist that I am, a short coming I'm sure, you deal with cancers and gangrenous the same way... you cut it out, you cut if off.

He also has some aplologists working out there for him now too. MSNBC has an article about how he got seared by the gun owners. Some author, George Wray, I think it was, says this is how we are taught to deal with the infidels by the NRA! Wrong!

The response to Zumbo wasn't crafted. It was a very visceral thing, in response to an also very rooted rationality and judgement of fellow shooters by Zumbo.

Look closely at what he said gentlemen... look at his reply. The statement was from the heart alright, the reply was quite thought out. And he harbors no grudges .... gee whiz... Zumbo... that is awfully decent of you.. I don't hold a grudge against you either... But I don't want you back. I don't want you near my children nor especially my grandchildren. You sir... are a pervert of another kind.

First Amendment. Yes. But the First Amendment leaves you opportunity for consequence doesn't it. It gives our enemies the means to take the now written words of others and cast them against us. Zumbo did not say he felt that AR-15's, semi-automatic rifles had no place in HIS gun closet... he said that they had no place, essentially, in the hands of ANY law abiding citizen, for these were TERRORIST guns.

Don't lose sight. Zumbo's remarks are a plague. Treat them as such.


Aloha... :cool:

Like I said, I won't be supporting Zumbo or Leatherman any time soon. I am seriously debating a donation to the NRA too, but my wife might kill me with all the money I recently spent. Simply put, unless war and crime end tomorrow, there will always be a need for firearms. I think this was previously mentioned in this thread or elsewhere on this board. We have to remember that the 2nd amendment is war/protection of the US driven. It is not hunting driven. So, what better weapons to establish a militia with than AR-15 and AR-10's. Some BMG-50's would be nice too. Heck, a couple of SAW's wouldn't be bad either. If not during my lifetime, I am pretty sure the US will be in a really heated war some time in the next century. I am betting it will be against China once China needs more resources, but who knows. The crazy thing is that this next war might even be partially fought on American soil.

People, Democrats specifically, do not realize that war is inevitable, just as crime and greed, and I think the former two are furthered by the latter.

Fabs, I thought you were joking. Now you just plain ass make me sick. If Hillary promises, you would be for handing over all guns.

Your not one of us. Your weak.


I have nothing further to say, but I used to give your posts alot of weight. They just got alot lighter, FWIW.

Andy,

I respectfully recommend that you slowly and carefully re-read Mr. Roman's posts while at the same time keeping in mind the definitions of "hypothetically speaking" and "sarcasm".

Andy,

That is fine with me. I don't need you to be a fan of mine, and have bumped heads with you on several other issues too. If you think I am weak, that is your opinion.

By the way, if we want to split hairs, it is "You're weak" and not "Your weak." That is one of my pet peeves on these boards, but I try to ignore it as much as possible. Funny thing is that I mentioned it last night on a cycling chat board after some grammar police were giving a guy a hard time about using the word bars where bar was appropriate.

If you cannot understand my point, then you either are not taking the time to read thoroughly, your reading comprehension is terrible, or you just cannot understand what I am trying to say. However, if I'm weak according to your standards, then I can fling poo too and call you an idiot, maybe even a moron, by my standards. That is another word I see used incorrectly way too many times on boards. People continue to use moreon.

Fling away my man, because I can fling back too.

Fabs please continue to share your opinions with us here. As a matter of fact everybody please continue to share your opinions here. There are alot of people in my country and yours who died so that we could express our opinions freely.

Mr. Zumbo is learning a lesson that we should all take to heart. Along with every right there goes an equal (if not more weighty) responsibility to exercise that right in an appropriate manner. He has the right to that opinion, however he must, and is, take responsibility for expressing it.

For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction.

If Hillary gets elected, we might all have a problem here and will be on the same page for sure. Fabs, I would have to say telling anyone (other than hunting buddies) about your brother owning an AR-15 was not a good idea. You just never know who is listening. Out of sight, out of mind.
As far as getting dusted here on HC, pick yourself up and dust yorself off.... Seems like everyone gets a turn in the barrell now and then. Once I had a relative on the wife's side thank me for taking some of the pressure off him. Said at least he isn't the only black sheep in the family. I just said YW. Tks to you. Seems some only see what they look for in a person. If they think you post sarcastic remarks, this is what they will see and take what you say in that order. We know we all here on HC stand behind the same door when it comes to the second and are all tired of the Brady bunch, Zumbo, Hillary, Kennedy bunches but can have a voice through the NRA. Now a membership there as a gift to your brother would be nice. Might get him started. Worked for me in the past. They all still belong.
I am on the board of a local sportsmens club that has over 600 senior members plus their wives along with about a hundred or so jr members and know it is hard to please everyone all the time. I have found out though the ones with the biggest mouth, the ones that refuse to follow the rules and are never happy with the way things go esp when not their way are also the ones that never show up at meetings or lend a hand doing anything constructive for the place. I just remind them they don't have to belong if it is that big a PIA to them. I love reading HC posts. We here sure can cover lots of topics, get many diff opinions and then can sort it all out in the end. As for me, going ice fishing in the morning, make a shore lunch for the bunch then sight in my 7mag I just put a scope on. Getting ready for my spring bear hunt in NB Canada with the son-in-law. One for lil Red....yeeee ha..

Ya know, the vast majority of folks here on HC are much more than the average outdoorsman, hunter, shooter, etc. You see how hard it is even for this specific interest group to all be on the same sheet of music.

I see it exactly the same way when it comes to supporting the NRA. I'm not a spokesman or nothin' else for that matter, but look at it this way. Zumbo took a hard fall because he didn't have no need for the AR's, etc. Hey, I don't shoot a straight bow, so if there's some law comes along to ban them, no sweat off my back. Come to think of it, same for the ARs, Knight MZ, or A5. Big deal, I don't use or need them?

All I'm trying to say is let's show a little more uniformity and not be so critical if someone has a slightly different view. I know this is an emotional issue for a lot of us, take five.

P.S. Skeeter, Waidmannsheil on your Spring Bear Hunt!! Sounds like a plan.

Skeeter,

I guess I just do not worry too much about owning an AR or letting people know that I plan on buying two, so I don't worry if people know that my brother owns one. At the end of the day, even if a law gets passed where AR's are illegal in MD, there will be a grandfather clause whereby you are required to register them with the Department of Public Safety, so the state will know who owns them. I think it is terrible, but if I happen to own a couple by that time I will be sure to register them. For most people, not registering them and getting caught with them would result in a slap on the wrist and the confiscation of the rifle(s). For me, I would be in a whole different world of hurt. I would have to report the guilty verdict to the Board of Accountancy and the Maryland & DC bars, and then I would probably have to go through a review before they renew my licenses to practice accountancy and law. You should have seen what I had to go through before taking the bar exam because I paid a fine for hunting migratory birds over bait, which if I had known better at the time, I could have just gone to Court, asked for probation before judgment, and avoided the entire guilty finding. What a mess.

If this bill gets passed, the big thing will be getting caught committing a crime with one of these "assault weapons" because there is a mandatory 5 year sentence. Honestly, I think that is the only part of the law that makes any sense. People should be able to own any gun they want, but if they commit a crime with one, there should be stiff sentences, and I mean for all guns.

What is clearly being demonstrated here in the posts, is the reason the anti-firearms groups are winning the battle. Slowly but surely they are cornering the firearms groups by using a shotgun approach. They are banking on the fact that people will splinter and try to save their own ass.......or interest group.

Lead bans, international small arms initiatives, domestic ammunition restrictions, assault weapons, terrorist weapons, Saturday night specials, sniper rifles...............one well thought out and very negative cliche after another, national and international bills, symposiums and agreements. Make no mistake, they are winning the war.

Now I know there are a bunch of you rearing up and getting ready to say, hah!!!.......you are from Canada and look what you bunch of wimps let your government ram down your throats. The fact is our firearms communities lobbied long and hard, but it did not save us. Firearms owners here continue to fight and we have made some small gains, but they are the gains that in the great scheme of things are kinda like throwing the dog a bone. It makes us feel good, but really isn't any kind of decisive victory and the overall picture is still a slow downward spiral into the anti-firearms pit.

Remember first that we did not have the 2nd Ammendment to wave like a flag, that RIGHT is not enshrined here, nor is it in most countries in the world. That alone will not save you now and from a foreignors perspective it has allowed most of your shooting population to lull itself into complacency, feeling safe in the knowledge that the right is enshrined in your constitution.

Complacency is why only a very small percentage of the US shooting population actually belongs to the NRA.......believe me I am not picking on you, it is the same everywhere. We are all being systematically chipped away at and they are winning. Slowly but surely.

Unfortunately the campaign for small-arms control and disarmament is a global one. They are attacking from all sides and they are relatively sure of victory in the long haul because the population base keeps growing and is predominantly urban and the firearms users are steadily becoming a smaller and smaller percentage of the overall population.

Jim Zumbo's recent comments, which have been flogged to death, should be a wake up call for all shooters and hunters. When an internationally recognized hunting/firearms writer, who grew up with the 2nd Ammendment rights, could actually make those comments on the internet, we are collectively in serious trouble. It is an indication of where the fight is at and it ain't pretty..........

First off...they took the original article off of outdoor life website...so I aint git to read it...anybody got another link?

Secondly...Fabs...
You must really be madder than a wet hen at me cause you know I'm the furtherst thing from grammatically correct. :p
Ya'll 2 smack lips at each other & make up. Both of ya'll are good peoples and have alot of respect from everyone here on the board...and 2 respectful fellas mad at each other makes the smart-arsh troublemakers like myself look good. We caint go havin that. ;)
Ya'll want me to go kick Zumbo's arsh? I'll represent the Hunt Chat community with pride and honor. I dont hit NO man below the belt:D

Zumbo
 

I've met and talked to him a few times, the last years ago when I was outfitting prariedog & coyote hunters. He asked for a free hunt for himself and 5 or 6 friends, I not only said no but "He** no"! He didn't show me much then and hasn't since. In fact Zumbo's a source of great amusment here in WY. He once gave a seminar on Elk calling at the G&F's annual EXPO. It was a total joke and most left it quickly. I think he needs to stick to selling his cookbook, it'll cause less damage.

That's my story and ima stickin to it! ;)

PS: I agree with Skyline.

Hey L'ilred
 

I'll see if I can't get a copy of what he said and send it to ya. Yeah, you guys have ta cool off and let things go.

Reds I can give ya Zumbo's address and his phone number and I'll even give ya a place to stay...on one condition. Can I come see ya do a l'ilred to him?? When I met him last year he WAS a bit pompous. Bet ya can take that outta his eeerrr ahhhh head!:D :D

Here is his website: http://www.jimzumbo.com/index.html

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...022301709.html

http://fieldandstream.blogs.com/gunn...ania_davi.html
http://fieldandstream.blogs.com/gunn...ania_part.html

This past weekend at the RMEF Elk Camp apparently after stepping down from his 2 year term on the Board od Directors, (not related to his story, his term was simply over) he got back on a plane and flew home. Can't say that I blame him as he would have been right in the middle of a fire storm with some of those guys.

I don't want to side track this thread, or beat it up any more, but does anyone else here have a hard time figuring out Petzal over at F&S ??

I've heard him trip over his own words more than once while running back & forth over other issues.

I quit reading F&S a few years back when he couldn't answer a question without doing a poor Don Rickles imitation and insult the writer. I very seldom read any of the outdoor magazines anymore.

Where have you gone Gene Hill.......

well i certainly dont wanna best a dead horse here...and i know very little about ar's or whatever the correct terms are fer em.
From what I've read in this thread...and I'm probaly missin somethin...but I'm assumin that Zumbo meant he didnt see no need for a fully automatic rifle in the woods?? or maybe he was picking on just the ar15's...the original blog I caint seem to find.

Anyway...Im uneducated about the subject so i caint argue nothin bout it..BUT (men hate it when women throw them buts in there ;) ) as long as it is legal then it is a matter of preference what you hunt with. Any retard who prefers to hunt with a fully automatic weapon needs his head examined aside from the fact that it's illegal.
I think what Zumbo did was scratch a surface and he didnt explain himself very well..like I do alot. (No, i aint forgot that other thread where somebody called me a name...i figgered I'd better behave and not reply at all...cause it would NOT be a good thing if i did...)
I think he was probaly misunderstood and he did a poor job of explaining himself. I personally find it scheitty that he gave so many of his years and time and money to the huntin community and everybody just schiet on him. You can be mad at him or whatever...but bein 2 cents short of sendin the poor bashturd into exile is too much. Not to mention that if you hang around with a gang of bank robbers, they'll more than likely think you are one too. That is the misfortune of the ar15's. It's a uneducated assumption that classifies things together out of sheer ignorance.
I can argue that same fact about Southerners. We are all labeled as haters of African- Americans. It is an uneducated guess.

Zumbo assumed that other people in this country also make that same uneducated guess that if you see somebody walkin in the woods with an ar-15 you should duck for cover. AND THEY DO!
So did Zumbo. People should be more educated on those weapons...inlcudin myself.
Apparently God don't make men with brass b**ls anymore.

Lilred
 

What Zumbo said in essence was that the government should not allow AR-15's to be used for any kind of hunting. Not full autos. He also said that they were just terrorist rifles and we really had no need for them. He likened everyone who had an AR15 to be as a terrorist. Heck, kiddo. An AR 15 is no different than any other semi auto shotgun or rifle..even the little 22 semiautos. There is no difference other than what they look like. I've had a few full auto firearms(I don't call anything firearm related as a WEAPON). A weapon is something that someone is going to USE against another person. It could be a bow..or a knife..or a gun...or even a rock. Weapon is onea them key words that the antis alway use. Why should we? You know I ain't what is known as politically correct. Just cause I consider myself to be a southerner..don't mean I belong to the KKK. That is what Zumbo more or less did. He considered all people that were AR15 owners and shooters to be as a terrorist. In this age when every dogooder in the country seems to know better than we do and thinks they should be our conscience..they want to control us cause we don't know as much as they seem to. You of all people should know that the 2nd amendment ain't about huntin. The Constitution allowed as it was originally written for the states to be their own conscience and were able to leave the Union if they saw fit. That is what the Civil War was really about. So the constitution was changed. We really can't let 'em change the 2nd amendment to a right to hunt. And Zumbo was an ignoramus that thought he was above gettin knocked down for his stupid comments.

:rolleyes:

Came late to the discussion, but here's my 2 cents...

Firstly, I feel bad that Zumbo made such a blatent comment. I did enjoy reading his columns and articles over the years, especially about elk hunting. Again, the free speech aspect comes up, but as many have pointed out, it's not a protection from people's reactions, just from the government locking you up for critisizing it...

Ah, but like some comments made by Mr. Ruger before his passing, it seems that one's own preference for a type of equipment got expanded into a belief about what other people should be allowed to use... The longbow/compoundbow/crossbow debate and the fracas involving dogs and deer hunting also come to mind.

I'm dissapointed he didn't see the inherent problem about publishing such comments, or how people in the shooting community would react.

Or especially the fact that his own preferred equipment, a bolt-action scope-sighted high-power rifle is "A Sniper Rifle" and the weapon of a political assassin in the minds of the same people who oppose ownership of so-called "assault rifles". JFK, Martin Luther King, and the Texas Tower Sniper are all still vivid images in the minds of the gun-control crowd and the TV watchers they appeal to... not to mention the Beltway Sniper...

Divide and conquer was a very effective strategy that let Julius Ceasar conquer the known world of his time. I'm surprised that Jim Zumbo didn't see that aspect of it as well.


:(

Email and brief written replies, even with emoticons, are a poor form of communication so please do not take this as disagreement or criticism but just perspective.

Nearly all my firearms are indeed weapons. I dont mince words, some are for shooting people and some for harvesting game. Some, very few, are for simple recreation (if hunting is a recreation for you that is fine but it is much more than that to me).

The latter two classes fall into the general class of "sporting goods", the former, are "arms" - that's what arms are; weapons, most specifically military weapons (see Miller Vs US). That is why there is a restriction on the governments right to restrict them in the Bill of Rights.

I suppose someone could make the difficult connect between my right to own sporting goods in some other ammendments and I would certainly support that, but I would not think it would win out in today's liberal courts.

So, if I am going to protect my rights to life, liberty and the pursuit of happines... I am going to need weapons. Fortunately some wise old men in powdered wigs saw that coming.

Hope that does not sound like too much of a rant.

Best regards,

Riposte