Well that's fine... you still didn't answer the question I was asking about shooting birds on the ground "in front of your dog"... meaning... if you missed the context.. what does the dog have to do with it?

And for the sake of conversation... Do you discuss your shooting parameters with your hunting partners before you hunt or do you just ASSUME everyone does it YOUR WAY? How often do you hunt with new people?

Rattus..
 

I'm just goint to try to explain. Not saying you aren't an ethical , safe or legal hunter. So don't get your panties all wadded up. Just try to read and understand.

Hunting where many of us grew up was an entry into manhood for a young'un. It was something where we were expected to LEARN(Emphasis is intentional) safety and certain rules. NOT rules of law or ethics or anything. Hunting was a social sport as well as something to put food on the table. As kids we all did things that were not socially acceptable to the people we hunted with. Everyone had their own pet peeves..but we lived within their guidelines ..Heck we were kids..to go hunting with the adults we would do anything. It was being accepted into their group. Most of these people were farmers and we knew if we were accepted into the circle of friends we had Thousands of acres of land to hunt. Now as to a man that hunted with dogs..especially quail or other critters you just didn't ground swat. It wasn't SOCIALLY acceptable. If you didn't want to live within the social rules you just didn't get to hunt with those people..or get to hunt their land. You can say these social rules aren't "fair" of right or whatever. It was the way we were raised and the way we as adults try to conduct ourselves to this day. I'm sorry you didn't get the opportunities to enjoy the sport and comraderie that we did(it just seems by your posts that you didn't). Nobody has said you are an illegal unethical or unsafe hunter. You are entitled to hunt by yourself in whatever manner you choose. But when you hunt with others..ya just gotta fit in. If you think that is wrong..well...I'm sorry but that is the way it is. So I may post more in this thread but nothing else will be addressed to you. Please stop arguing about semantics.

Oh and another thing..we learned when hunting with a new "friend" that we asked what they expected of us. especially a
when we were kids. Still do it today. 12 of us are getting together this Saturday to discuss our elk hunting foray..guess we'll get the major stuff settled then such as camp chores etc.

Skeet... I appreciate all that and is no different than what I wrote you, posted here or whatever.... and this is NOT ABOUT ME skeet. It's amazing how you seem to either NOT READ what I've sent you, or just blindly assume things not in evidence.

What I specifically told you if I remember rightly.. but then it was about 20 minutes or so ago, so my memory might be faulty by now, but I seem to remember telling you that what you are taught are your ethics. Didn't I say that somewhere along the line to you... maybe several times? No matter.. if you are taught that ground sluicing is not acceptable then those become your "ethics" if that is what you want to call it. I agree with that.

If you are taught that ground sluicing is ok and its legal, then those teachings are the ethics as you are taught. Are your ethics more important than someone elses?

If someone new comes into your circle, do you take the time to explain what your practices are... IE... we don't shoot birds on the ground... or conversely, shoot birds on the ground but not over my dog... whatever.. rules are established for the game.

I gave you an example of effective range, or did you not read that part... if one has an effective range of 50 yards, is accurate at 50 yards, and kills 100% at 50 yards... does that individual have a right to impose that limitation on others or they are "unethical" as has been suggested is the attitude of some on this forum?

If you go out and shoot constantly throughout the year and get ready for hunting with your pet loads etc, is your guest who hasn't shot at all since last season unethical because he hasn't practiced to assure himself to as accurate as he could be? Would some folks consider that to be unethical skeet?

Now as for the gist of your last post... Please don't patronize me skeet. You've done that enough already besides calling me stupid. I don't go around insulting peoples intelligence as you do skeet and it is right into the playbook of my "criticism" of those who consider their way the only way and everyone else is "unethical".

Please don't ASSUME anything of my childhood skeet or how "disadvantaged" I may have been. The more you do it the more your ignorance is paraded in front of the forum. I NEVER SAID ANY OF THIS WAS ABOUT ME.... so let's get off that theme too could we.

By the way skeet... how was I supposed to take that "panties" reference skeet... and you wonder why I posted what I did? Like I said skeet, its one thing to grow up with a certain practice or "ethics" and a completely different thing to suggest in an open ended manner to assign as unethical the practices of others just because they don't "fit" your mold.

And then there is the flip flop ethic... this is ok if you're new to hunting to get confident, but as you gain confidence its not. Hello?? We have thought police here? We certainly have some squirrel police here, which I found to be really a big haha and points out exactly what I'm saying. Some people have too much time on their hands yet still don't bother to actually think about what they are saying. And I'm still waiting for the list of "unethicals"... I believe there were about 50?

You said it correctly skeet... finally... you practice your hunting style and your friends who are in your circle have certain practices that YOU all accept as how you hunt. Those in YOUR circle who would not subscribe to YOUR "ethics" should be asked to leave. Who's got a problem with that? I certainly don't. But that is not at all what started this conversation.

If it is legal, there are no unethicals. If you know and stick to your effective range in your hunting gear and have studied your quarry as to where to shoot to kill it, you're ready to hunt.

Aloha.. :cool:

???
 

Sheesh..Some people are so disadvantaged they don't even realize it. I guess I just don't understand...Ladies and gentlemen..Rattus IS exactly what he portrays himself to be.:D

Yes ladies and gentlemen... Rattus is exactly what he portrays himself to be.. a prohunter advocate who doesn't preach divisiveness by deriding how other people hunt as others here on this forum seem to relish.

Rattus is a guy who actually participates in preserving, protecting and promoting public hunting.

I don't know of a single person on this forum who relishes deriding other people rattus58.

Its those very kind of statements that are causing the issue now.

I will pm Rocky to lock this thread and end this ignorance.

GoodOlBoy

This simply means that your hunting with dogs and they go on point to birds. While pointing out the birds the perfectly legal but unwise hunter shoots them on the ground in front of the dogs. They would never do it again because the owner of these dogs would do alot of yelling if he didn't hit you. To even joke about shooting in front of someone especially your wife is ridiculous. But you don't shoot in front of dogs because that dog just might decide to move and then you just harvested a nice pointer or spaniel just guessing but they prolly don't go into the mixed bag.

5 quail
1 pheasant
4 rabbits
1 spaniel

good day and good eats...prolly not

Bout Time.
 

I will pm Rocky to lock this thread and end this ignorance.


YAAAAAAYYYY!!

:D :D

Re: Bout Time.
 

Me 2,3,4, and 5.

Fact is ya shoulda done it on Page 2.

Best wishes, Bill

I am in awe of this forum. I really am.... I'm serious.... you folks really need some help here. I've just read Youngbucks post and you folks are an amazement. Honestly this thread has proven beyond all reasonable doubt that you folks are wrapped up with yourselves beyond help.

It also proves to me that most of you don't read or can't read, or refuse to think about what is said.

His point of shooting a bird over dogs WHILE THE BIRD IS ON THE GROUND, (though not what the first statement was, which was "in front of my dog") a simple statement and the only one here to actually answer my question, and YB... I thank you. You are probably the only one with a brain cell on this thread between the two or three that have communicated with me on this issue.

The other two or three of you should belong to science.

And YB... while I appreciate your concern for my wife... and though I realize you mean well you too did not read what I said. Read it again, and maybe again, if you haven't got it then, maybe a third time.... because nobody here seems to be able to understand english.

But just in case you didn't get my private little chuckle, my wife eats what I shoot but can't stand to see anything shot. Not even a mouse. And since NO ONE here seems to remember my frame of reference here, I don't hunt with dogs. I use a muzzleloader shotgun for birds and a muzzleloader for everything else. Flushing dogs, pointers... I think I understand the difference. I did get past third grade, thank you.

Why would anyone be shooting birds on the ground with the use of dogs? I wouldn't, I don't, and I don't know anyone who does. But no one takes the time to read what people say here and things take on a life of its own..... a point I tried to make over and over.



Aloha....

Insulting members of this board is not going to ingratiate you to anybody Rattus, and to be perfectly honest its not going to be tolerated. You can aloha and smileyface until you are blue in the face but you are insulting and it is YOU that does not understand plain english. Most of the board members we have are well educated, and even those that aren't are mostly good honest intelligent people.

You opinions have nothing to do with reality, you don't seem to be able to grasp even the most basic concepts of courtesy, and if you can't understand why people would be disturbed by you shooting game directly in front of your wife then you have proven beyond a reasonable doubt that you have little to no reguard for anybody or anything other than yourself.

If I could lock this thread myself I would have already.

Consider all futher posts of yours ignored by me. I will no longer converse with you or acknowledge your existance.

GoodOlBoy

Excuse me.... But it was skeet that started the insults. And I'm afraid, Good Ol Boy, that you have YOUR OPINIONS about things and I have mine. I've not insulted anyone here my friend, I am only pointing out facts in play. That YOU or the other one or two can't read, won't read, won't look back to what I've posted, then I'm sorry...

Opinions have nothing to do with reality.... never mind.... this board thread whatever you callit... is nothing BUT OPINION... there is no reality here.... get a grip.

As to whether or not YOU pay attention to my posts has been irrelevant, since you are not paying attention to them anyway and are assuming much not in evidence all the way through so it really is a no net loss for me isn't it.

Aloha... and no smiley faces..... :D

I read the entire thread last night, and actually started to post a reply in support of you rattus and stating that this arguing is just a huge waste of time. In fact, it gave me a headache reading it. Then, after writing almost a book, I got so PO'ed about this entire thread that I deleted the post. I have been extremely busy with work and a one year old lately. So much so, that I haven't ridden my bike in 3 weeks and can barely find time to hunt. I deleted the post because I didn't want to get involved in this cement head debate. By the time I finished reading the thread, I had almost forgotten what you guys started arguing over. Then I remembered. It was ethics, which is so subjective that it really isn't worth arguing over. There can be so many different scenarios to why a person takes a particular shot, and you never know exactly what they were thinking when they took the shot.

Call a truce and be done with this already.

Hi Fabsroman.... Well count me in then... I'm man enough to say let by gones be bygones.... So I'm up with it.

Thanks for bring this back to earth.... :)

Much Aloha... Tom :cool:

There have been so many of my 10 commandments broken on this thread that I'm closing it before it gets out of hand any more than it already has.