I have the 8.5 X 25 illuminated dot Mueller and find it bright,it holds with 1/8 MOA per click when adjusted and is very clear and crisp.Another great feature about the illuminated dot is it only covers about 3/4 ' at 200 yds.The Mueller is on my 204 Remington and holds groups at around 3/4"' at 100 yds.cant ask for to much more ,as I'm still in load development with this 204 so overall I must admit to being very happy with the 8.5 X 25 X 50 Mueller
