"Locked and Cocked" is not ok with Mike!

[popplecop]

Agree with Rapier, except for last paragraph. 1911A1s were standard issue for some specialized units in Korea, from PFC on up, didn't have any Pvts in our unit and only a few PFCs.

[jl1966]

Rapier,
You make some valid points. As I do not know the story of how the military came to mandate their style of carry for the 1911, I will defer to your wisdom on that. As to the troops issued the gun through the years, there are many documented cases of combat troops getting and using arms they were not officially issued. I have a coworker from Boston who was in the Navy, he doesn't know one end of a gun from the other, but he knows he was issued a .45 pistol. So my point was, maybe a 1911 is not the best weapon for daily carry for an inexperienced individual. 1911s are more prone to being malfunctioned by the user, due to the safety aspects you mention. Thumb safties get knocked back on, a proper firing grip is not obtained activating the grip safety, slide stops get activated. Not to mention the fact that the more highly tuned they get, the more ammo finicky they are. In just about any match or shooting school I have attended the bulk of the down time is due to someone, usually an inexperienced shooter, trying to get his 1911 sorted out. My opinion, and everyone has one, is that a glock, sig, or some such system is preferable for everyday carry. You cant beat those 1911s for target work though, and they sure are pretty.

[Dutchman01]

Originally Posted by jl1966

Rapier,
You make some valid points. As I do not know the story of how the military came to mandate their style of carry for the 1911, I will defer to your wisdom on that. As to the troops issued the gun through the years, there are many documented cases of combat troops getting and using arms they were not officially issued. I have a coworker from Boston who was in the Navy, he doesn't know one end of a gun from the other, but he knows he was issued a .45 pistol. So my point was, maybe a 1911 is not the best weapon for daily carry for an inexperienced individual. 1911s are more prone to being malfunctioned by the user, due to the safety aspects you mention. Thumb safties get knocked back on, a proper firing grip is not obtained activating the grip safety, slide stops get activated. Not to mention the fact that the more highly tuned they get, the more ammo finicky they are. In just about any match or shooting school I have attended the bulk of the down time is due to someone, usually an inexperienced shooter, trying to get his 1911 sorted out. My opinion, and everyone has one, is that a glock, sig, or some such system is preferable for everyday carry. You cant beat those 1911s for target work though, and they sure are pretty.

I carry a browning hipower, same cocked and locked system as the 1911 except the grip safety and I just hafta' say if you can't handle a manual safety you surely don't need to be carrying glock! I mean, honestly. Glocks seem really dangerous to me if only because they don't have a manual safety. I might make an exception for that NY trigger but that can't be good for actually hitting something.

[Mr. 16 gauge]

I think we have all heard or seen about this clip....so much for the 'safety' of the glock. I think that the bottom line is this: it is the nut behind the trigger that is responsible for safety.
Choose your gun based on your needs, and then PRACTICE, PRACTICE, PRACTICE..................

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-PYHR72u51Q

...and then there is this one:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CT0CTbO7L44

[Rapier]

For some reason several of you just did not understand my statement, so I will repeat it, "only those with a handgun TO&E (Army term) are issued handguns." TO&E for those not framiliar with the term is the military regulations that set forth the equipment every troop of every job class will be issued, from fork to weapon.

It does not make any difference if you are Army, Navy or Marines. If your job, at any time, calls for a handgun to be issued to you, you are issued a handgun, period, no other time, and that is by regulation. So if a unit has handuns it is by regulation, if a navy troop has a handgun issued it is by regulation. You can change jobs on a temp basis and a rifleman will have a handgun issued for that job, but the temp job class calls for a handgun. Troops in the military do not just wonder around with issued handguns just because they want one. That is just more Hollywood BS.

As an armorer, I had to know the regulations as every one wanted to carry a handgun while just walking around or on manuvers. Then everone wanted a rifle, no one wanted a handgun as a principal weapon, when the ballon went up.

What happens in combat, is a whole different matter, folks tend to pick up all manner of field junk and carry it. Example, in Europe in WWII very few GIs did not carry a small German or Italian pistol of some description in 32, 380 or 25. You see them everywhere in the US as returned souviners.

90% of all failures with a clip fed handgun are the result of clip problems, not a problem with the gun itself.
Best,
Ed

[Dutchman01]

Originally Posted by Mr. 16 gauge

I think we have all heard or seen about this clip....so much for the 'safety' of the glock. I think that the bottom line is this: it is the nut behind the trigger that is responsible for safety.
Choose your gun based on your needs, and then PRACTICE, PRACTICE, PRACTICE..................

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-PYHR72u51Q

...and then there is this one:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CT0CTbO7L44

Oh man, those videos are completely scary. So, is the problem the officers or the glock?