Winners & Losers

[skeet]

Oh PC..you're just an ol stick in the mud...like me! Ya know..watch TV commercials stuff to kill germs..laws..bicycle helmets for kids seat belt laws( a real money maker ya know)..then all the new calibers. I mean how did we as kids live into adulthood without dying from oooey gooey stuff on our hands?? How did we ever lay a deer low with a paltry 30-30?? or kill a duck with a tiny little 2 3/4 inch 20 ga shotgun?? Gotta have a 315 Super duper Tyrannosaurus Rex round or the 3 1/2 inch 10 ga to shoot teal Sheesh

[fabsroman]

Originally Posted by skeet

Oh PC..you're just an ol stick in the mud...like me! Ya know..watch TV commercials stuff to kill germs..laws..bicycle helmets for kids seat belt laws( a real money maker ya know)..then all the new calibers. I mean how did we as kids live into adulthood without dying from oooey gooey stuff on our hands?? How did we ever lay a deer low with a paltry 30-30?? or kill a duck with a tiny little 2 3/4 inch 20 ga shotgun?? Gotta have a 315 Super duper Tyrannosaurus Rex round or the 3 1/2 inch 10 ga to shoot teal Sheesh

Skeet,

Things were a lot different 100 years ago when you and Popplecop were born. LOL Back in the days, there were no laws about non-toxic shot, there were a lot less cars on the roads and 40,000+ people a year didn't die in auto accidents, they didn't even make bicycle helmets back then, car seats for kids were pretty much non-existent, and plastic had yet to be invented.

A .30-30 is still a great rifle for those closer shots and hunting in the brush, but it does not cut it when hunting over a wide open bean field.

Now, a 10 gauge, or a 3 1/2" 12 gauge is way too much to shoot teal with. I tend to use 2 3/4", maybe 3" if that is all I have, for shooting teal.

[skeet]

Originally Posted by fabsroman

Skeet,

Things were a lot different 100 years ago when you and Popplecop were born. LOL Back in the days, there were no laws about non-toxic shot, there were a lot less cars on the roads and 40,000+ people a year didn't die in auto accidents, they didn't even make bicycle helmets back then, car seats for kids were pretty much non-existent, and plastic had yet to be invented.

A .30-30 is still a great rifle for those closer shots and hunting in the brush, but it does not cut it when hunting over a wide open bean field.

You know Fabs..way back when I was a kid 40,000 people died from auto accidents a year..or thereabouts..Nontoxic shot was out there..It was tested way back in 1957. The testing done to promulgate nontoxic was flawed when it was done and created a flawed "need" for same.. Oh and plastic was around..Remember the AA shell??1963 car seates were in use and seat belts for cars was mandatory in 1967 or before..Available clear back as far as the 40's in fact. The only thing that made them mandatory was blithering idiots who created a "need" for the common good. Yep..kids got hurt on bicycles..in cars or even (horrors) in the back of pickups.. People are usually hurt because of stupidity and a seat belt bicycle helmet or airbag just won't necessarily save their lives....There have been too many laws passed to protect us from ourselves. Remember he old saw..Here..hold my beer..watch this!!

As far as the new calibers..new rifles new shotguns....Fabs..we as a group of hunters really don't NEED a Super Duper 3 1/2 inch 12 ga..Most ducks doves geese quail etc etc will be dispatched just as well with the ol 2 3/4 inch 1 1/4 oz or less loads that were standard for scores of years. The 30-30 is just fine for 95% of deer hunting in the US. Hunting isn't necessarily bean field shooting...in fact really isn't hunting..it is waitng to have a deer come out so it can be dispatched..No I ain't a tree hugger..but most of the "hunting" now days isn't really hunting as per the actual meaning of the word. I have done it that way too...but I really liked sneakin through the woods on as equal terms with the deer as possible. As far as technology..you answered your own query..the technology of shooting has gone avbout as far as possible with the use of hundred year old designs of firearms..cartidge containers and pressures that can be handled safely..as you said..even in bikes..how much faarther can you go. The law of diminishing returns rears it's ugly maw..again. Look at the new compound bows.. Have nothing against 'em but they really aren't BOWS in the common term..To be really honest..about half the people who are fairly sucessful hunters with compounds probably wouldn't be half as succesful with a real recurve or longbow. Technology shouldn't take the place of the skill needed to hunt

[fabsroman]

Originally Posted by skeet

You know Fabs..way back when I was a kid 40,000 people died from auto accidents a year..or thereabouts..Nontoxic shot was out there..It was tested way back in 1957. The testing done to promulgate nontoxic was flawed when it was done and created a flawed "need" for same.. Oh and plastic was around..Remember the AA shell??1963 car seates were in use and seat belts for cars was mandatory in 1967 or before..Available clear back as far as the 40's in fact. The only thing that made them mandatory was blithering idiots who created a "need" for the common good. Yep..kids got hurt on bicycles..in cars or even (horrors) in the back of pickups.. People are usually hurt because of stupidity and a seat belt bicycle helmet or airbag just won't necessarily save their lives....There have been too many laws passed to protect us from ourselves. Remember he old saw..Here..hold my beer..watch this!!

As far as the new calibers..new rifles new shotguns....Fabs..we as a group of hunters really don't NEED a Super Duper 3 1/2 inch 12 ga..Most ducks doves geese quail etc etc will be dispatched just as well with the ol 2 3/4 inch 1 1/4 oz or less loads that were standard for scores of years. The 30-30 is just fine for 95% of deer hunting in the US. Hunting isn't necessarily bean field shooting...in fact really isn't hunting..it is waitng to have a deer come out so it can be dispatched..No I ain't a tree hugger..but most of the "hunting" now days isn't really hunting as per the actual meaning of the word. I have done it that way too...but I really liked sneakin through the woods on as equal terms with the deer as possible. As far as technology..you answered your own query..the technology of shooting has gone avbout as far as possible with the use of hundred year old designs of firearms..cartidge containers and pressures that can be handled safely..as you said..even in bikes..how much faarther can you go. The law of diminishing returns rears it's ugly maw..again. Look at the new compound bows.. Have nothing against 'em but they really aren't BOWS in the common term..To be really honest..about half the people who are fairly sucessful hunters with compounds probably wouldn't be half as succesful with a real recurve or longbow. Technology shouldn't take the place of the skill needed to hunt

It is called evolution my man. Technology will continue on. I'm willing to bet you use plastic decoys that weren't around 100 years ago. Those plastic shells weren't around 100 years ago. The powders we have nowadays weren't around 100 years ago. Plastic stocks weren't around 100 years ago. The hunting clothing you use nowadays to allow you to stay out in the field longer weren't around 100 years ago. The list goes on and on. Yeah, some of the "technology" is BS, and some of it just gives a very slight advantage compared to what it replaces. However, for those willing to spend a ton of money on this technology, it opens the way for newer technology. Over time, what is a small advancement here and a small advancement there ends up being a large advancement over time. The same goes for bikes, cars, cell phones, etc.

If you told me 10 years ago that I could hold a cell phone in my hand that would allow me to receive e-mail, send texts, take pretty decent pics, send pics to others on cell phones, chat in groups with family members and others, etc., I would have told you you were out of your mind. Heck, 10 years ago I didn't even own a cell phone and was completely against them. Now, I don't leave the house without my Blackberry.

Again, some "technology" isn't needed, and that usually dies a terrible death. Now, look at Dow Corning. It invented a very strong type of glass back in 1963 and there was no use for it. However, today it is being used in cell phone touch screens and LCD TV's. It is supposedly going to make the company billions of dollars.

Do I really need a 3 1/2" 12 gauge for waterfowling, probably not, but that elongated shot string allows for more error and the possibility fo hitting doubles with a single shot. Now, the 10 gauge 3 1/2" has a little more firepower in it, but I still don't own one. Both of them give me enough of a back ache and headache that I would only use them on big geese.

The mandatory seatbelt law didn't come into effect until the mid 80's or later. Car seat laws are there because the poor child shouldn't be punished for the stupid parents' mistakes. There are plenty of laws on the books for our own safety, but how many people really even know they are out there. I bet half the people in Montgomery County have no idea that any child under 12 years of age is required, by law, to wear a helmet while riding a bike. Had about 5 kids riding their bike in the neighborhood today without helmets on. I have seen plenty of bike wrecks and destroyed helmets to know that they work.

Imagine what the freeway would be like without laws in place.

When areas were less populated and the pace of life was a lot slower, it was a lot easier to live with fewer laws. Now, that isn't the case. I'm pretty sure it would be really bad news if I and others were allowed to kill the deer outside my townhouse in the early morning and late afternoon. Any yahoo could go out there and start firing like crazy with a rifle while my daughter and son are out playing.

Yeah, I don't mind having some of the laws in place. When you live on the Eastern Shore or Wyoming, you don't need quite as many because things are different.